Cutler to replace Plummer as Broncos' starting QB

[JayGee]

Cutler to replace Plummer as Broncos' starting QB
ESPN.com news services

The Denver Broncos quarterback controversy is headed for a resolution.

Jay Cutler

Cutler

Head coach Mike Shanahan will turn to rookie Jay Cutler to replace incumbent Jake Plummer for the rest of the season, starting with the team's Dec. 3 game against Seattle.

The Denver Post first reported the change Sunday, and team sources confirmed to ESPN's Chris Mortensen that Cutler will take over. ESPN.com's John Clayton said there's "no question" Cutler will be the starter against the Seahawks.

Jake Plummer
Quarterback
Denver Broncos

Profile
2006 SEASON STATISTICS
Att Comp Yds TD Int Rat
315 175 1886 11 12 70.5

Plummer has struggled all season despite leading the Broncos to a 7-4 record. Denver ranks 26th in the NFL with 171.5 pass yards per game and is tied for 21st in the league with 17.7 points per game. Plummer's passer rating of 70.5 is 29th in the league, ahead of only Bruce Gradkowski (70.1), Drew Bledsoe (69.2), Matt Leinart (68.1), Vince Young (56.1), and Andrew Walter (55.0).

That's not the most prestigious list. Bledsoe was benched after six games for Dallas in favor of Tony Romo; Gradkowski, Leinart, and Young are all rookies; and Walter is in his first year as a starter.

Plummer, meanwhile, is in his 10th season and has started 46 straight games for the Broncos since 2003 but has been unable to get the offense moving in 11 games this year.

[native az]

Shanahan is probably the most overrated coach in the history of football.

I can't wait to see this blow up in his face.

[Drachir]

Wrong time to be playing musical QB's. I have to totally disagree with this decision since the Broncos are playing for a playoff spot and by putting in a rookie you are pretty much throwing that chance out the window. It sucks to do it playing against Seattle because now you are giving the Seahawks a great chance to win and we need them to lose out. The only way a rookie QB should start is if your starting veteran QB goes down with an injury.

[JCardinal81]

I hope Cutler fails miserably. Can't believe all of this pre/post draft hype about this guy and how he's the next Elway/Favre. I was so pissed off when there was all this talk of us drafting him at 10 before Leinart fell. The guy has a cannon and looked good in preseason, but then again, so does John Navarre. His team sucked in college and now so will Denver.

[KidStallyn]

I hope Cutler fails miserably. Can't believe all of this pre/post draft hype about this guy and how he's the next Elway/Favre. I was so pissed off when there was all this talk of us drafting him at 10 before Leinart fell. The guy has a cannon and looked good in preseason, but then again, so does John Navarre. His team sucked in college and now so will Denver.

This has the potential to be a Ryan Leaf part duex....People in Denver will be given a load of brown stuff if he doesn't perform like John Elway right out of the gate......He could be the next great post game sound bite.......stupid, stupid move at this point of the season...

[DUSK884]

Cutler sure looked like the best rookie QB in the league during the preseason if you ask me... with Matt coming in close second.

However... any Denver failure is a success in my eyes.

[KidStallyn]

Cutler sure looked like the best rookie QB in the league during the preseason if you ask me... with Matt coming in close second.

However... any Denver failure is a success in my eyes.

That was preseason when defenses are extremely vanilla.....no comparison to week 12 of the NFL season....

[native az]

That was preseason when defenses are extremely vanilla.....no comparison to week 12 of the NFL season....

Looks like someone lost a bet.:pointup:

[Mookie]

Shanahan is probably the most overrated coach in the history of football.

I can't wait to see this blow up in his face.


Two SB's (back-to-back), and always top 5 in the league in rushing, solid defense ... yea, he really sucks:banghead:

[SO. CAL Heart-Throb]

where are my 2 buddies in here that i told cutler would eventually start for the broncos this year.. they swore up and down it wouldnt happen... I'm always right.. i'm great!!!

[combokid54321]

Two SB's (back-to-back), and always top 5 in the league in rushing, solid defense ... yea, he really sucks:banghead:

Yeah, might I add only one losing season in his whole career of coaching the Broncos, 3 playoff trips last 3 seasons, no matter who is behind the line they end up being a 1000 yard rusher, better winning PCT than any other coach that has been with their team 5 or more years, and after his contract extension he will be the most paid coach in the NFL.

yeah he really really REALLY sucks

[native az]

Yeah, might I add only one losing season in his whole career of coaching the Broncos, 3 playoff trips last 3 seasons, no matter who is behind the line they end up being a 1000 yard rusher, better winning PCT than any other coach that has been with their team 5 or more years, and after his contract extension he will be the most paid coach in the NFL.

yeah he really really REALLY sucks

Never said he sucked. He is way overrated as a coach. Lets not forget he drafted Tommy Maddux, Brian Grease, and brought in the Fake. Not to mention he traded away Clinton Portis for another overrated player in Champ Bailey. He had success with Elway and Terrel Davis, but who wouldn't.

[Spider TX]

Never said he sucked. He is way overrated as a coach. Lets not forget he drafted Tommy Maddux, Brian Grease, and brought in the Fake. Not to mention he traded away Clinton Portis for another overrated player in Champ Bailey. He had success with Elway and Terrel Davis, but who wouldn't.

You call the best cover corner in the NFL overrated? You are clearly dillusional after that remark. He didn't have to keep Portis because he can get any running back to have success behind that line, so it was a great trade to get Bailey, because there is nobody better at that position.

[combokid54321]

Never said he sucked. He is way overrated as a coach. Lets not forget he drafted Tommy Maddux, Brian Grease, and brought in the Fake. Not to mention he traded away Clinton Portis for another overrated player in Champ Bailey. He had success with Elway and Terrel Davis, but who wouldn't.

Yes... he traded Portis for the best CB in football and the Broncos running game was and still is just as dominate if not more without Portis.. Jake may have sucked this season but he has been to the playoffs every year in Denver, and is what 40-12 as a starter?

[native az]

You call the best cover corner in the NFL overrated? You are clearly dillusional after that remark. He didn't have to keep Portis because he can get any running back to have success behind that line, so it was a great trade to get Bailey, because there is nobody better at that position.

When it comes to trading a proven RB for a CB, yes he is overrated.

[Spider TX]

When it comes to trading a proven RB for a CB, yes he is overrated.

These comments by you makes it so easy to disregard anything you post on here, because you clearly don't know what you are talking about.

You can find a running back all the time and have him produce like that. A great corner is very tough to come across, and it's not often you get a chance to get the absolute best corner.

[combokid54321]

When it comes to trading a proven RB for a CB, yes he is overrated.

He was only proven in Denver... sure he has been good in Washington but his stats are nothing compared to his in Denver. It was a great move by Shanahan, trading Portis for the best CB in the league, and still having the same numbers from the running game with Portis gone, and maybe even better.

And you can say any coach is bad for drafting a player that doesn't have success... there is an NFL draft every year, PLENTY of players end up bad in the NFL. You picked three players Shanahan brought in to call him overrated(one of which has won 75% of his games and been to the playoffs every year). There are busts year in and year out, it doesn't make any coach overrated to draft a player who doesn't perform well.

[native az]

These comments by you makes it so easy to disregard anything you post on here, because you clearly don't know what you are talking about.

You can find a running back all the time and have him produce like that. A great corner is very tough to come across, and it's not often you get a chance to get the absolute best corner.

What back in Denver has consistently produced (year in and year out) on the level that Portis has? Bailey was supposed to put them over the top, guess what, that hasn't happened.

[native az]

He was only proven in Denver... sure he has been good in Washington but his stats are nothing compared to his in Denver. It was a great move by Shanahan, trading Portis for the best CB in the league, and still having the same numbers from the running game with Portis gone, and maybe even better.

And you can say any coach is bad for drafting a player that doesn't have success... there is an NFL draft every year, PLENTY of players end up bad in the NFL. You picked three players Shanahan brought in to call him overrated(one of which has won 75% of his games and been to the playoffs every year). There are busts year in and year out, it doesn't make any coach overrated to draft a player who doesn't perform well.


Yeah his stats were terrible when he left Denver.:whistle:
http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/302215

[Mookie]

Yeah his stats were terrible when he left Denver.:whistle:
http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/302215

More Carries, more pounding, less YPC... Whats your point?

[combokid54321]

Yeah his stats were terrible when he left Denver.:whistle:
http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/302215

I said compared to Denver they are nothing... and if you are looking at it and comparing everything THEY ARE... its funny because his first two years were in Denver.. you would expect his third and fourth year to be better... and they weren't nearly as good.

[combokid54321]

2003 Denver Broncos 13 13 290 1591 5.5 65 14 13 76
2004 Washington Redskins 15 15 343 1315 3.8 64 5 5 65

he had 53 more carries in 04 than 03... and almost 300 more yards in 03... rofl

[native az]

I said compared to Denver they are nothing... and if you are looking at it and comparing everything THEY ARE... its funny because his first two years were in Denver.. you would expect his third and fourth year to be better... and they weren't nearly as good.

All of a sudden 1500 & 1300 yards is nothing. With a team not as good as the Donkeys.

[native az]

More Carries, more pounding, less YPC... Whats your point?

And yet Denver hasn't had a back as good as Portis in any of the years after they traded him.

[Mookie]

Why would they when they just produce backs in the 6th + round of the draft? Had anyone heard of Reuben Droughns before the 04 season?

[Spider TX]

And yet Denver hasn't had a back as good as Portis in any of the years after they traded him.

They still get the production as a whole, they don't need Portis. It was a great trade for both teams.

[native az]

Why would they when they just produce backs in the 6th + round of the draft? Had anyone heard of Reuben Droughns before the 04 season?

He still play for Denver?

[combokid54321]

And yet Denver hasn't had a back as good as Portis in any of the years after they traded him.

They almost had 2 1000 yard rushers in one season last season... the #2 in NFL... they didn't have that when Portis was there.. The point is they traded Portis for the best CB in the league, and had an even better running game with Portis gone.. I don't care if its two backs or three doing it rather than one, they rushed better last season than either of the seasons with Portis.

[native az]

They still get the production as a whole, they don't need Portis. It was a great trade for both teams.

I will never say that was a great trade. Just like this latest move of playing Cutler instead of the Fake. It doesn't make them any better and will probably make them worse.

[combokid54321]

I will never say that was a great trade. Just like this latest move of playing Cutler instead of the Fake. It doesn't make them any better and will probably make them worse.

I don't understand how it didn't make them any better by having a better running game without Portis, plus the best CB in football...

[Spider TX]

I will never say that was a great trade. Just like this latest move of playing Cutler instead of the Fake. It doesn't make them any better and will probably make them worse.

You keep sounding clueless over here. Enjoy it. I'm gonna go have some real football discussion.

[native az]

They almost had 2 1000 yard rushers in one season last season... the #2 in NFL... they didn't have that when Portis was there.. The point is they traded Portis for the best CB in the league, and had an even better running game with Portis gone.. I don't care if its two backs or three doing it rather than one, they rushed better last season than either of the seasons with Portis.

How many Super Bowls have they been to since they got Bailey? That was the supposed reason for the trade. Sorry they are no better with Bailey.

[native az]

You keep sounding clueless over here. Enjoy it. I'm gonna go have some real football discussion.

Please come back after next weeks game and we will see how great of a move starting Cutler is and how smart Shanascrub is.

[combokid54321]

How many Super Bowls have they been to since they got Bailey? That was the supposed reason for the trade. Sorry they are no better with Bailey.

They went 9-7 and 10-6 with Portis, 10-6 and 13-3 with Bailey.... they made the trade to IMPROVE the team... I think 23-9 is better than 19-13...

[native az]

They went 9-7 and 10-6 with Portis, 10-6 and 13-3 with Bailey.... they made the trade to IMPROVE the team... I think 23-9 is better than 19-13...

Who was the QB when they went 9-7?

[Egomaniac247]

The Portis/Bailey debate is kinda moot....both players are great....but honestly, Denver has a knack for producing with whatever RB they desire..

Terrell Davis
Quinten Griffin after that
Reuben Droughns after that
Mike Anderson & Tatum Bell after that


Now it's Tatum Bell and Mike Bell....and Tatum has been injured this year which is why they're having a few issues...but they're still not bad.

So long story short, the RB for a CB thing isn't really a great point to bring up in the Shanahan/Overrated discussion...

Personally I don't think he's overrated but I DO think pulling Jake is a knee jerk reaction and will bite them. To me it smacks of giving in to the hype from the media and fans.

Remember last year when the media was calling Plummer "No Mistake Jake" ??

Convenient that no one in the media remembers that either.

Plummer is not a bad QB. He's not GREAT but he's very servicable....to me it just seems like someone needed to get to him and get in his head....restore a little confidence. It's tough to have confidence when the media and fans are calling for Cutler in the first game of the season. Talk about turning your back on a guy who has won quite a bit for them...

[combokid54321]

Who was the QB when they went 9-7?

Griese... and with Plummer what they improved from 9-7 to 10-6? And then 10-6 to 13-3... one game away from the super bowl the second year... it just looks like they play alot better with Bailey than Portis, honestly..

[native az]

The Portis/Bailey debate is kinda moot....both players are great....but honestly, Denver has a knack for producing with whatever RB they desire..

Terrell Davis
Quinten Griffin after that
Reuben Droughns after that
Mike Anderson & Tatum Bell after that


Now it's Tatum Bell and Mike Bell....and Tatum has been injured this year which is why they're having a few issues...but they're still not bad.

So long story short, the RB for a CB thing isn't really a great point to bring up in the Shanahan/Overrated discussion...

Personally I don't think he's overrated but I DO think pulling Jake is a knee jerk reaction and will bite them. To me it smacks of giving in to the hype from the media and fans.

Remember last year when the media was calling Plummer "No Mistake Jake" ??

Convenient that no one in the media remembers that either.

Plummer is not a bad QB. He's not GREAT but he's very servicable....to me it just seems like someone needed to get to him and get in his head....restore a little confidence. It's tough to have confidence when the media and fans are calling for Cutler in the first game of the season. Talk about turning your back on a guy who has won quite a bit for them...

Just think of how much better they would run the ball with a consistent RB in the mix. Musical chairs with any position is not good. Plus the opportunity cost invested in having to go out and find new talent every year at the same position.

[native az]

Griese... and with Plummer what they improved from 9-7 to 10-6? And then 10-6 to 13-3... one game away from the super bowl the second year... it just looks like they play alot better with Bailey than Portis, honestly..

Or Jake started playing better last year because he had been in the system one more year. Bailey has little to do with the Donkeys improvement last year.

[combokid54321]

The Portis/Bailey debate is kinda moot....both players are great....but honestly, Denver has a knack for producing with whatever RB they desire..

Terrell Davis
Quinten Griffin after that
Reuben Droughns after that
Mike Anderson & Tatum Bell after that


Now it's Tatum Bell and Mike Bell....and Tatum has been injured this year which is why they're having a few issues...but they're still not bad.

So long story short, the RB for a CB thing isn't really a great point to bring up in the Shanahan/Overrated discussion...

Personally I don't think he's overrated but I DO think pulling Jake is a knee jerk reaction and will bite them. To me it smacks of giving in to the hype from the media and fans.

Remember last year when the media was calling Plummer "No Mistake Jake" ??

Convenient that no one in the media remembers that either.

Plummer is not a bad QB. He's not GREAT but he's very servicable....to me it just seems like someone needed to get to him and get in his head....restore a little confidence. It's tough to have confidence when the media and fans are calling for Cutler in the first game of the season. Talk about turning your back on a guy who has won quite a bit for them...

In my opinion the drafting of Cutler has made Jakes play decrease this season... Sure the Broncos drafted him for the future, but I think Jake has been playing bad and with fear of what just happened to him all season long. The Broncos are 7-4 and Plummer has played terrible, Shanahan makes this move because he doubts Cutler could do any worse..

[Spider TX]

Native AZ, go out and get just a little football knowledge, then rejoin the discussion, because you are making yourself sound completely clueless in here. Good luck.

[combokid54321]

Or Jake started playing better last year because he had been in the system one more year. Bailey has little to do with the Donkeys improvement last year.

Yes I'm sure him having more interceptions by himself than some entire teams, intercepting Brady and returning it to the 1 yard line in the playoffs to give the Broncos a 17-6 lead rather than a 13-10 deficit, has very little to do with the success.

[native az]

Native AZ, go out and get just a little football knowledge, then rejoin the discussion, because you are making yourself sound completely clueless in here. Good luck.

I thought you were leaving? Don't make yourself into a liar, just leave.

[Spider TX]

Yes I'm sure him having more interceptions by himself than some entire teams, intercepting Brady and returning it to the 1 yard line in the playoffs to give the Broncos a 17-6 lead rather than a 13-10 deficit, has very little to do with the success.

He wouldn't know anything about that.

[native az]

Yes I'm sure him having more interceptions by himself than some entire teams, intercepting Brady and returning it to the 1 yard line in the playoffs to give the Broncos a 17-6 lead rather than a 13-10 deficit, has very little to do with the success.

Not to mention his repeadely getting burned in the AFC championship against the Steelers.

[combokid54321]

Not to mention his repeadely getting burned in the AFC championship against the Steelers.

haha... I saw him get one or two passes caught on him, and I saw Plummer having 4 turnovers and the Broncos 2 other CBs who were both rookies struggling... I didn't see anything wrong with Bailey.

[Spider TX]

Not to mention his repeadely getting burned in the AFC championship against the Steelers.

Gunny, is that you?

[native az]

haha... I saw him get one or two passes caught on him, and I saw Plummer having 4 turnovers and the Broncos 2 other CBs who were both rookies struggling... I didn't see anything wrong with Bailey.


I am not saying Bailey is a bad CB, I just believe you don't ever trade someone that produces TDs for someone who prevents them.

[Spider TX]

I am not saying Bailey is a bad CB, I just believe you don't ever trade someone that produces TDs for someone who prevents them.

Trading a running back who can be replaced behind that great OLine for a shut down corner who is the best in the league is a great trade that would and should be made every chance a coach gets. Running backs come and go all the time. Big time corners are tough to find.

[combokid54321]

I am not saying Bailey is a bad CB, I just believe you don't ever trade someone that produces TDs for someone who prevents them.

The Broncos had 22 rushing TDs last season, more than either of the seasons with Portis. They ran the ball for more yards, had a better YPC, as well. Bailey had more INTs than some entire organizations, was huge in the game in the playoffs vs the Pats, had 3 or 4 INTs for TDs last season. I think the Broncos improved dramatically after the trade.

[Egomaniac247]

Like I said, the Broncos have no problems finding a productive RB. I know I'd never heard of Droughns, Portis, Griffin, Bell, Anderson, etc before they came through Denver....

Look at guys like Chester Taylor, Willie Parker, Lamont Jordan, etc. All were backups...and all stepped in and are productive.

To me it's easier to find a RB than a shut down Corner.

But anyways, that's another thread. Denver would have done fine going in either direction.

That being said, I agree with combokid54321 about why Plummer's playing badly and I sorta said it earlier too....It's a confidence killer to have a 1st round QB drafted and hear the media and fans saying "when? when? when?" all season...

It reminds me of how Patrick Ramsey was treated in Washington. At times he showed flashes of greatness yet he would make rookie mistakes....well, the Washington coaches (ie Spurrier) screwed with his head, constantly starting him, benching him, starting him, benching him.....at one point I think Spurrier flat out said "he's my starter" then benched him like a game or two later.....then when the other QB's didn't work out (cough cough Rosenfels), Ramsey was back in there as the starter....only to get jerked again.

It killed the guys confidence and PROBABLY killed his career. Ramsey isn't seen as much more than a backup QB now.


While I never hope for a player to perform badly, part of me kinda does want Cutler to perform badly and Plummer to leave the organization, going to a team that needs a solid QB....like Cleveland, Buffalo, Oakland, etc.....wouldnt' that be a hoot, Plummer in Oakland playing against the Broncos :)

We've seen how quickly a good QB can turn a franchise around (Drew Brees)....

[Tiz]

Never said he sucked. He is way overrated as a coach. Lets not forget he drafted Tommy Maddux, Brian Grease, and brought in the Fake. Not to mention he traded away Clinton Portis for another overrated player in Champ Bailey. He had success with Elway and Terrel Davis, but who wouldn't.


The worst part of your complaint is that he had thousand yard rushers with backs since getting rid of portis and in doing so he got a player on defense that could get turnovers, which is something he didn't have. Two years in a row Champ has been near the top in turn overs and while his first two years in Washington Portis has had 2800 rushing yards Denver did not miss a playoff beat one of which he went to the AFCCG while Washington didn't go to the NFCCG. This year the player you so gave massive props to is on IR while Champ is having a great year forcing TO and shutting down WRs again. Washington is on the outside of the playoffs and has to have alot of things go right to have a shot at the wildcard and Denver is trying to preserve a chance at a divisional win.

Now you can call jake a fake all you want but Shanahan was able to win and go to the AFCCG with that fake at the QB position so that says alot about Shanahan as coach. Overrated he may be but i'm sure you'd love to have him be overrated and have those overrated wins in AZ.

It just baffles me how a fan of a franchise who struggles just to see 6 wins combined in 2 years would complain about a coach who has a successful tenure like Shanahan. If he's overrated your team and history of coaches shouldn't even be allowed near D3 colleges.

[Tiz]

When it comes to trading a proven RB for a CB, yes he is overrated.

What shanahan did is prove that with a proven blocking system and proven line the RB becomes almost obsolete and at that position becomes plug-n-play. He's a coach and their system is one that had 1k rushers in Droughns and orlandis gary not to mention having 1900 yards combined with Tatum Bell and Mike anderson last year. To say that they needed Portis last year is to act like Peyton needed Randy moss.

[Tiz]

2003 Denver Broncos 13 13 290 1591 5.5 65 14 13 76
2004 Washington Redskins 15 15 343 1315 3.8 64 5 5 65

he had 53 more carries in 04 than 03... and almost 300 more yards in 03... rofl


it's a bit misleading due to different blocking scheme his first year as a redskin. Joe gibbs acknowledged that and went to a zone blocking scheme his 4th year and Portis was back to being a 1500 yard back.

but as you pointed out in another thread. Denver still got the production out of the position they had from Portis and that's all that counts and what Washington found out, if you don't have a great scheme and players like Denver does at the oline having a great back in there doesn't mean anything once he goes down to injury cause you don't get production from your back ups.

[SunDevilDon]

Shanahan is probably the most overrated coach in the history of football.

I can't wait to see this blow up in his face.

I hate the Broncos, and I hated Elway and his horse teeth and T. Davis and his roids. With that said, I have respect for Elway and do for Jake Plummer as well because he just wants to win.

If you look at what Shanahan has had to work with (talent wise) year in and year out, how can you say he's overrated. Dan Reeves didn't win a SuperBowl with Elway in his prime. Sure, if it wasn't for a roided up TD, they probably wouldn't have won one at all, but that's how it goes.

Shanahan has done a lot considering he's making it to the playoffs virtually every year and not getting TOP DRAFT PICKS. He makes things work to win games, and has won the BIG ONE too, so when saying he is OVERRATED, that is just plain ignorant. From what I can tell, you are a Jake Plummer fan (as I am too), and are upset that he's gonna lose his job as a starter, so you are making uneducated accusations. They went after Cutler to be their guy, and he's under heat and since Jake is NOT going to be in Denver next year (unless Culter breaks his neck, or maybe even if he doesn't break his neck), why not give it a shot?

[native az]

Yeah that Shanahan guy is really smart.

[native az]

Funny how none of the Shanahan people are not back in this thread??????

Not only did Cutler play like he was supposed to (like a rookie). Shanaturd tried some stupid trick play that got Elam hurt, and they lost the game. Can't wait till the Donkeys don't make the playoffs and it will be all because of OVER RATED Shanaturd.

[PiercingCard77]

Funny how none of the Shanahan people are not back in this thread??????

Not only did Cutler play like he was supposed to (like a rookie). Shanaturd tried some stupid trick play that got Elam hurt, and they lost the game. Can't wait till the Donkeys don't make the playoffs and it will be all because of OVER RATED Shanaturd.

Shanahan did nothing during his scripted plays that would allow Cutler to settle his nerves...he played Cutler as though he was a seasoned vet..what was he thinking.

I thought at times our offensive line was bad....the Broncos pass protection this year has been horrible, did he really think a rookie would preform well under those circumstances. Look how Leinart played during the Raiders and Packers game...like a rookie.

This is a great way to destroy a rookie QB......that game was how bad habits start and rookies fail.

[Tiz]

Funny how none of the Shanahan people are not back in this thread??????

Not only did Cutler play like he was supposed to (like a rookie). Shanaturd tried some stupid trick play that got Elam hurt, and they lost the game. Can't wait till the Donkeys don't make the playoffs and it will be all because of OVER RATED Shanaturd.



decided not to post prior to the game whether Cutler did good or bad because it's ONE GAME. It would mean very lil to come back and gloat if Cutler had a good game or half then fell out against bottom feeeding teams. Sad to say but Leinart had a strong start against KC and CHI then he was ineffective for 2 games and now he's come back strong so what good would it be to gloat or say "i told you Cutler could or couldn't play" after just ONE GAME.

With all said and done Cutler still with that loss has a chance to still be the QB of a playoff team THIS YEAR he could also start of slow and catch the W-train like one Vince Young and yet you're hear to gloat and call out people after just ONE GAME.

let me remind you that after one game you guys were 1-0 then went along time before you guys got your 2nd win so once again ONE GAME MEANS LITTLE...

anything else?!

[kjbad]

Two words...

ELI MANNING.

DEN threw Cutler in there just like NYG did Manning, when they had a chance to get into the playoffs, and if it comes back to bite them, look at what they are in for in a couple of years. And their fans are on par or worse than NYG fans in unrealistic expectations.

[native az]

decided not to post prior to the game whether Cutler did good or bad because it's ONE GAME. It would mean very lil to come back and gloat if Cutler had a good game or half then fell out against bottom feeeding teams. Sad to say but Leinart had a strong start against KC and CHI then he was ineffective for 2 games and now he's come back strong so what good would it be to gloat or say "i told you Cutler could or couldn't play" after just ONE GAME.

With all said and done Cutler still with that loss has a chance to still be the QB of a playoff team THIS YEAR he could also start of slow and catch the W-train like one Vince Young and yet you're hear to gloat and call out people after just ONE GAME.

let me remind you that after one game you guys were 1-0 then went along time before you guys got your 2nd win so once again ONE GAME MEANS LITTLE...

anything else?!

My rant has very little to do with Cutler. It had more to do with Shanaturd and his monster ego that made him think that he could replace The Fake with a rookie and still be able to pull off wins. I actually think Cutler will be a decent qb in the future, but you don't switch to the guy in the middle of a playoff hunt.

If you thought Cutler played bad against the weak Seachickens wait till the Chargers are blitzing his ***.

[Tiz]

I'm sure his game against SD won't be any worse than Leinart's 40 QB rating against Oakland Gr,ossman's horrendous Rating in numerous games this year or even Plummer's own QB rating of 26.3 against StL.

[Wisconsin Cards]

:jumping: Cutler sucks

[native az]

I'm sure his game against SD won't be any worse than Leinart's 40 QB rating against Oakland Gr,ossman's horrendous Rating in numerous games this year or even Plummer's own QB rating of 26.3 against StL.

You can't compare Plummers bad outing in the first game of the year. Plummer is a proven starting QB in the league, he had a good year last year (as much as I dislike the guy). The Leinart, Grossman comparisons are valid however.

I just will never understand why people put Shanaturd on a pedestal. He won 2 Super Bowls yes, but he also had 2 of the greatest offensive players of that time. I think he is a good coach, but I also believe he lets his ego get in the way of making sound decisions personnel wise.

[SunDevilDon]

Funny how none of the Shanahan people are not back in this thread??????

Not only did Cutler play like he was supposed to (like a rookie). Shanaturd tried some stupid trick play that got Elam hurt, and they lost the game. Can't wait till the Donkeys don't make the playoffs and it will be all because of OVER RATED Shanaturd.

First of all, I am not a "Shanahan Person". I think it's ridiculous to say someone with a proven track record for winning, and with a winning record currently is a bad coach or knock him for his decisions. I don't even know why anyone on here cares. Are you a Broncos fan? They are the only ones who should be discussing this kind of thing anyways. I don't care if the Broncos make the playoffs or not, it doesn't affect the Cardinals one single bit. Lovie Smith went with a rookie QB last year and then, even though they were winning and on their way to a 11-5 record, he threw Rex Grossman in there who had started what, 4 games prior to that? I didn't see you in here questioning Lovie Smith so I assume you are the exact same type of person (doing so for Plummer) who comes in here and cries for Kurt Warner, although I haven't seen them around the past 3 weeks.

And if for some reason, Cutler works out and gets the Broncos into the playoffs and wins one or two game, you would be NOWHERE to be found just like the Warner lovers after Leinarts 405 yards and 2 victories the past 3 weeks.

[native az]

First of all, I am not a "Shanahan Person". I think it's ridiculous to say someone with a proven track record for winning, and with a winning record currently is a bad coach or knock him for his decisions. I don't even know why anyone on here cares. Are you a Broncos fan? They are the only ones who should be discussing this kind of thing anyways. I don't care if the Broncos make the playoffs or not, it doesn't affect the Cardinals one single bit. Lovie Smith went with a rookie QB last year and then, even though they were winning and on their way to a 11-5 record, he threw Rex Grossman in there who had started what, 4 games prior to that? I didn't see you in here questioning Lovie Smith so I assume you are the exact same type of person (doing so for Plummer) who comes in here and cries for Kurt Warner, although I haven't seen them around the past 3 weeks.

And if for some reason, Cutler works out and gets the Broncos into the playoffs and wins one or two game, you would be NOWHERE to be found just like the Warner lovers after Leinarts 405 yards and 2 victories the past 3 weeks.

SDD, this is the NFL teams forum. Where else should we talk about other NFL teams??????

Secondly if Cutler does guide the Donkeys to the playoffs I will be right here. If I am wrong it won't be the first time and I am not afraid to call out things like I see them. Why the hell would someone be afraid of making a mistake about calling something out on a message board?????

[Tiz]

You can't compare Plummers bad outing in the first game of the year. Plummer is a proven starting QB in the league, he had a good year last year (as much as I dislike the guy). The Leinart, Grossman comparisons are valid however.

I just will never understand why people put Shanaturd on a pedestal. He won 2 Super Bowls yes, but he also had 2 of the greatest offensive players of that time. I think he is a good coach, but I also believe he lets his ego get in the way of making sound decisions personnel wise.



So you can't compare a proven vet having a bad game to a rookie having a bad game because of what reason? Simply put and the point you obviously missed is that even if Cutler plays like an average QB it's no worse than what their original QB was given them so it doesn't detract the team but on the flipside being that Cutler is a rook he's younger and obviously isn't as set in his mistake prone ways which is why every other rookie who has started at QB this year has gotten better as the season progressed.

[native az]

So you can't compare a proven vet having a bad game to a rookie having a bad game because of what reason? Simply put and the point you obviously missed is that even if Cutler plays like an average QB it's no worse than what their original QB was given them so it doesn't detract the team but on the flipside being that Cutler is a rook he's younger and obviously isn't as set in his mistake prone ways which is why every other rookie who has started at QB this year has gotten better as the season progressed.

You fail to mention the other rookies started because their teams were failing. The Donkeys were well in position to return to the playoffs. Jake gives the Donkeys the best chance of winning Cutler does not. The change is ego driven, just like Shanaturd bringing in the Fake and thinking he could make chicken **** into chicken salad.

I also believe that Shanaturd brought in Cutler to take some of the heat off himself. Shanaturd knew that if he stuck with Jake and went out of the playoffs early his job would come into question the following season. So he decides to start Cutler that way any failure could be scape goated on Cutler being a rookie. Shanaturd now has to hope that Cutler is the real deal in the coming years otherwise he will be fired or asked to step down.

[kjbad]

This is how sad it is in DEN...they still need Elway so they don't feel emasculated. Unbelievable...

http://www.rockymountainnews.com/drmn/sports_columnists/article/0,1299,DRMN_83_5191509,00.html

Krieger: Hey, Broncos: Elway's here and needed

Dave Krieger

December 5, 2006
ENGLEWOOD - It seems like a no-brainer. The Hall of Fame Rocket Man and the Rocket Man to be. They're already in the same town. Shouldn't they get together?

Unfortunately, it is not automatic because John Elway doesn't have anything to do with the Broncos these days, aside from being their most famous icon.

Elway runs the Colorado Crush of the Arena Football League and may be getting back into the car business with his divorce from AutoNation. But nearly eight years after his retirement, he has no connection to the NFL. He has met Jay Cutler once, in passing.

So I asked him Monday if he thought there might be a role for him mentoring the Broncos' strong-armed rookie quarterback.

"You know, if I was asked, there's no question I would," he said.

About the same time, Mike Shanahan was getting ready to do his postmortem on the Broncos' third loss in a row, so I made my way down to Dove Valley to see if he agreed.

"I think it would be very valuable for a guy to just sit down with John, not only about football, but just about the position in general," Shanahan said. "John went through everything here in Denver."

Sooooooo, I wondered, would the team take the initiative to make it happen?

"To be honest with you, I was thinking about (doing) that at the end of the season," Shanahan said.

"Just talking to John and saying, 'Hey, you've been through it all and maybe you guys could get together and have a couple beers or dinner and give you a chance to kind of enlighten him a little bit, what's in store.' "

The awkwardness of my shuttle diplomacy reflects the odd situation on the ground: Elway is the greatest Bronco of all time, living right here, eager for a meaningful position in the NFL, and yet has no role with the Broncos. To understand why, we have to back up a little.

When Elway retired following the 1998 season, he had an option from Broncos owner Pat Bowlen to buy a small piece of the team. In fact, that offer got Bowlen into a legal dust-up with former Broncos owner Edgar Kaiser, but that's another story. In the end, the option proved to be more trouble than it was worth because Elway never exercised it.

"To me, where the Broncos were and where I would have fit in, it wasn't the right fit at the time," Elway explained. "I think L.A. was going on around that time and I was talking to some groups out there. The timing wasn't right. I just always thought that at some point in time down the road I'd get another opportunity. And I still think I will."

Elway was part of a group trying to land an NFL expansion team in Los Angeles. The expansion team ended up in Houston instead. When I asked Elway if he still harbors ambitions of getting back in the league, he did not hesitate.

"Yeah, at some point in time," he said. "I just haven't had an opportunity up to this time. I think (about) that especially as my kids grow up. I love the arena league, it's been a great experience, so if that doesn't come about, I'm thrilled and happy to be with the arena league. But I'd definitely look at some opportunities if they were to arise."

So why haven't the Broncos and Elway found a way to get together again?

Bowlen, who considers Elway a friend, declined to comment. Shanahan, who coached Elway for much of his career, offered this:

"No. 1, he's too smart to coach. He's too smart to put in all that time. Someone has to decide if they're going to be involved with the organization, and it's very time consuming. I think that's the first thing. Someone has to ask themselves do they want to spend the time to be full time? To do that is a big commitment. I don't think the average person understands. John does."

Does the same apply to management work?

"Yeah," Shanahan said. "Well, management relative to football. I can't speak for the (business) side, but relative to a GM or a scout, a college scout or a pro scout, you're talking about a lot of hours. John's making too much money for that."

I admit I have trouble with this explanation, logical as it sounds. If Elway isn't willing to break down tape 16 hours a day or spend his nights in airport hotels on scouting trips, the Broncos have no place for him?

I believe Elway didn't exercise his option to buy a piece of the Broncos because all the meaningful jobs at Dove Valley were taken and he wasn't interested in being either a figurehead or a grunt.

All the meaningful jobs at Dove Valley are still taken. But intelligent people who get along, as Bowlen, Shanahan and Elway claim to, should be able to figure something out. Elway is no figurehead in the AFL. His stewardship of the Crush has been successful from both a football and business standpoint. He and Jon Bon Jovi are the league's leading ambassadors.

Somehow, some way, the greatest Bronco of them all should have a role with the franchise. If Shanahan makes good on asking him to lend Cutler a hand when the season is over, that could be a first step.

[native az]

This is how sad it is in DEN...they still need Elway so they don't feel emasculated. Unbelievable...

http://www.rockymountainnews.com/drmn/sports_columnists/article/0,1299,DRMN_83_5191509,00.html

Krieger: Hey, Broncos: Elway's here and needed

Dave Krieger

December 5, 2006
ENGLEWOOD - It seems like a no-brainer. The Hall of Fame Rocket Man and the Rocket Man to be. They're already in the same town. Shouldn't they get together?

Unfortunately, it is not automatic because John Elway doesn't have anything to do with the Broncos these days, aside from being their most famous icon.

Elway runs the Colorado Crush of the Arena Football League and may be getting back into the car business with his divorce from AutoNation. But nearly eight years after his retirement, he has no connection to the NFL. He has met Jay Cutler once, in passing.

So I asked him Monday if he thought there might be a role for him mentoring the Broncos' strong-armed rookie quarterback.

"You know, if I was asked, there's no question I would," he said.

About the same time, Mike Shanahan was getting ready to do his postmortem on the Broncos' third loss in a row, so I made my way down to Dove Valley to see if he agreed.

"I think it would be very valuable for a guy to just sit down with John, not only about football, but just about the position in general," Shanahan said. "John went through everything here in Denver."

Sooooooo, I wondered, would the team take the initiative to make it happen?

"To be honest with you, I was thinking about (doing) that at the end of the season," Shanahan said.

"Just talking to John and saying, 'Hey, you've been through it all and maybe you guys could get together and have a couple beers or dinner and give you a chance to kind of enlighten him a little bit, what's in store.' "

The awkwardness of my shuttle diplomacy reflects the odd situation on the ground: Elway is the greatest Bronco of all time, living right here, eager for a meaningful position in the NFL, and yet has no role with the Broncos. To understand why, we have to back up a little.

When Elway retired following the 1998 season, he had an option from Broncos owner Pat Bowlen to buy a small piece of the team. In fact, that offer got Bowlen into a legal dust-up with former Broncos owner Edgar Kaiser, but that's another story. In the end, the option proved to be more trouble than it was worth because Elway never exercised it.

"To me, where the Broncos were and where I would have fit in, it wasn't the right fit at the time," Elway explained. "I think L.A. was going on around that time and I was talking to some groups out there. The timing wasn't right. I just always thought that at some point in time down the road I'd get another opportunity. And I still think I will."

Elway was part of a group trying to land an NFL expansion team in Los Angeles. The expansion team ended up in Houston instead. When I asked Elway if he still harbors ambitions of getting back in the league, he did not hesitate.

"Yeah, at some point in time," he said. "I just haven't had an opportunity up to this time. I think (about) that especially as my kids grow up. I love the arena league, it's been a great experience, so if that doesn't come about, I'm thrilled and happy to be with the arena league. But I'd definitely look at some opportunities if they were to arise."

So why haven't the Broncos and Elway found a way to get together again?

Bowlen, who considers Elway a friend, declined to comment. Shanahan, who coached Elway for much of his career, offered this:

"No. 1, he's too smart to coach. He's too smart to put in all that time. Someone has to decide if they're going to be involved with the organization, and it's very time consuming. I think that's the first thing. Someone has to ask themselves do they want to spend the time to be full time? To do that is a big commitment. I don't think the average person understands. John does."

Does the same apply to management work?

"Yeah," Shanahan said. "Well, management relative to football. I can't speak for the (business) side, but relative to a GM or a scout, a college scout or a pro scout, you're talking about a lot of hours. John's making too much money for that."

I admit I have trouble with this explanation, logical as it sounds. If Elway isn't willing to break down tape 16 hours a day or spend his nights in airport hotels on scouting trips, the Broncos have no place for him?

I believe Elway didn't exercise his option to buy a piece of the Broncos because all the meaningful jobs at Dove Valley were taken and he wasn't interested in being either a figurehead or a grunt.

All the meaningful jobs at Dove Valley are still taken. But intelligent people who get along, as Bowlen, Shanahan and Elway claim to, should be able to figure something out. Elway is no figurehead in the AFL. His stewardship of the Crush has been successful from both a football and business standpoint. He and Jon Bon Jovi are the league's leading ambassadors.

Somehow, some way, the greatest Bronco of them all should have a role with the franchise. If Shanahan makes good on asking him to lend Cutler a hand when the season is over, that could be a first step.

Just helps prove my point that Shanaturd is not as smart as he or others think he is.

Why wasn't this done for the Fake?

[native az]

Thanks Shanaturd for proving me right. What a ***** this guy is turning out to be without Elway.

[SunDevilDon]

Thanks Shanaturd for proving me right. What a ***** this guy is turning out to be without Elway.

His first two starts came vs. 2 very good teams.

:topic:

[Egomaniac247]

I think in passing he did okay today didn't he?

He just had something like 3 fumbles....including one that gave LT the rushing TD record lol...that was so classic...

LT ties it up with only a few minutes left and you're thinking he won't get the chance to break it this week.....then Cutler fumbles on like the 10 yard line and the Chargers get it back....boom, LT TD and a record :)

Anyways, I was reading a Chris Collinsworth article on NFL about "Christmas presents to NFL Teams" and one was:

"A sad, sad movie for Jake Plummer who can't stop smiling since last week"

Ain't that the truth....I'm not saying Cutler isn't going to make it in the NFL but he certainly has not given the Bronco's any spark at all.

Denver got slobber-knockered today....I still think this is a terrible decision for a team that was in the playoff hunt....and is now in 3rd place in their division because of it.

[Tiz]

I think in passing he did okay today didn't he?

He just had something like 3 fumbles....including one that gave LT the rushing TD record lol...that was so classic...



He was horrible first half did good the 3rd quarter even tho his ball placement wasn't the greatest on his last TD pass. All in all when SD wanted to sack him they did it seemed like their pass defense was playing with him on most downs but on 4th downs late in the game they got to him with ease. I think we are finding out the real problem with the Broncos and it's the line.

[Egomaniac247]

That's pretty bold to say that considering that historically the Bronco's O-Line is among the league's best.

I'm not saying you're wrong, you might be right....but I'd have to really pay attention to that to say I agree with it because Tatum Bell is still able to run the ball pretty effectively....

But yea....that's an angle I hadn't considered.

[Tiz]

That's pretty bold to say that considering that historically the Bronco's O-Line is among the league's best.

I'm not saying you're wrong, you might be right....but I'd have to really pay attention to that to say I agree with it because Tatum Bell is still able to run the ball pretty effectively....

But yea....that's an angle I hadn't considered.



Consistently among the best against the run, i agree but against a team with a solid rush the only thing that's saved them over the years has been Plummers ability to get out of the pocket.

As for Tatum Bell he's getting alot of his runs because he's now being able to break tackles, much like today, as he was getting hit early on in the play and breaking tackles to get outside.

[Egomaniac247]

Ah well, I'm just smiling knowing that the Bronco's playoff hopes are continually slipping away and it all started with Plummer being benched.

I don't "dislike" Cutler, I just like Plummer and thought it was a really stupid move to bring in a rookie when you're trying to make a run at home field advantage in the playoffs....now they're fighting to even stay in the playoffs.

[Tiz]

Ah well, I'm just smiling knowing that the Bronco's playoff hopes are continually slipping away and it all started with Plummer being benched.

I don't "dislike" Cutler, I just like Plummer and thought it was a really stupid move to bring in a rookie when you're trying to make a run at home field advantage in the playoffs....now they're fighting to even stay in the playoffs.



LOL. I don't really want them in the playoffs either. I think I'm happier with their Defense being exposed as much as it has been. In the ravens-bronco game I knew need to try more double moves because Bailey and Darrent williams constantly look at the QB when dropping into coverage but we don't go deep enough and we don't try anything offensively that is to intricate.

[native az]

Had to bump this. I love to see the Donkeys and Faketanahan fail. Way to go Faketanahan you prove once again you are to smart for the rest of the league.

[Tiz]

Had to bump this. I love to see the Donkeys and Faketanahan fail. Way to go Faketanahan you prove once again you are to smart for the rest of the league.


Cutler is the first rookie QB to have 2 TD passes in each of his first 4 games.

[kjbad]

The Broncs are done thanks to the QB change and they've lost Darrent Williams to an off-the-field incident...wanna get away, Shanny?

[native az]

Cutler is the first rookie QB to have 2 TD passes in each of his first 4 games.

Is that for the other team? Cutler is not the problem in Denver, its Faketanahan.