Page 12 of 13 FirstFirst ... 210111213 LastLast
Results 111 to 120 of 122

Thread: Gut feeling who the cardinals may pursue for Qb after Palmer

  1. #111
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Posts
    698

    Default

    One other point. Dorsey and Reid who have a win now team with Smith made a draft day decision to give up picks this year and next to move up to take Smith's replacement. They could have used picks to strengthen their team now with Smith. That says two things to me. One that getting a future high quality NFL QB is worth giving up picks for and two, they aren't sure if Alex Smith can get them where they want to go.

  2. #112
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Posts
    1,952

    Default

    It also says that Smith is 34 years old and the Chiefs had an opportunity to maybe get a franchise QB. A QB who they can groom for a couple year and take over for Smith so there is no lag. Sure it cost them picks. If Mahomes turns out to be that QB it's well worth the picks. That's the chance you have to take sometimes. Their in the same boat as the Cards. Just good enough not to get those top 5 or 7 picks so most if not all the good college QB are already taken.

    I think SK is hoping beyond hope that Gabbert is a bridge QB. Someone who can maybe give the Cards a couple good years so they have more time to find the right guy. He is only 27. If he were to turn into an above average QB the guy has at east 6 years of good play. That gives SK plenty of time to find his next QB. I also think SK knows Stanton isn't the answer, so he is looking for someone who can step in for Palmer. Gabbert fits that description a lot better than Stanton. SK doesn't think he can win with Stanton. Which I agree with.

  3. #113
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Posts
    1,337

    Talking

    Quote Originally Posted by Biggs View Post
    You are kidding with this? You do realize that the Bengals and Oakland when Palmer was there were two of the most dysfunctional organizations in football when Palmer was on them. Kapernick actually took virtually the same team Smith had further than Smith did and he is essentially out of the league. When Brady went down BB got 10 wins out of Cassel and made him a very rich man.

    Your entire premise that we should get Smith is based on Andy Reid and John Dorsey making a decision to trade him. KC is a solid football organization with a team ready to win now. If they decide to dump Smith, that says it all. Andy Reid runs the Alex Smith friendly system. Dorsey has built a team based on running the football and D. Very much in the mold of the 49ers team that soured on Smith. If these two decide to move on from Smith, the idea that we should get him in order not to take a shot at a young QB by giving up picks for him is insane.

    There's a lot I don't love about Palmer. One thing I will say, Smith would never have seen the field if he and Palmer were both on the same team and healthy during their NFL career's. Palmer with all his flaws is miles better than Smith.
    So, when a QB that you personally like has a lousy W-L record, it is the fault of the team. When a QB that you personally don't care for has a lousy W-L record, it is the fault of the QB.

    Smith played under some of the worse conditions for a few years with SF and still left with a winning record. Palmer had a better team surrounding him in Cincy and left with a losing record. You can try and rewrite those facts any way you want and still be wrong.

    As to Palmer beating out Smith, take a look at the trade scenarios for both QBs.

    Palmer had little cred with the league after 'retiring' with millions of Cincy's money in his bank account. Palmer was held in such high regard by a QB hungry league that the Cards were able to trade for him at the cost of a swap of 2013 pick and a conditional 7th round pick---if Palmer was beaten out of the starting position by Stanton, he would have been FREE. Raiders went with Matt Flynn over Palmer. Guess his 35 TD-30 Int ratio was not good enough for the Raiders. Oakland dumped Palmer after only two years---In Oct.2011, the Bengals traded the "retired" Palmer to the Raiders for a first-round pick in 2012 and a second rounder in 2013 — a significant amount of compensation for a quarterback who had no interest in playing for Cincy. Oakland walked away from Palmer even after the large draft investment. Palmer had put up some passing yards with Oakland, but as many fans can testify to, plenty of his passing yards came in 'garbage time' when the game was lost.

    http://www.nfl.com/videos/arizona-ca...zona-Cardinals

    I'll leave it to you to check out the trade cost to KC for Smith (PS It wasn't a FREEBIE).

    http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/9...as-city-chiefs

    KC is only doing their job in positioning themselves with a QBOTF. Smith is an aging vet (as is Palmer) and KC took the gamble that Mahomes would be their guy when Smith is at the end of the trail. If only the Cards had the same foresight.
    Last edited by Canyonram; 05-24-2017 at 01:25 PM.

  4. #114
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Posts
    1,337

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Itancan View Post
    It also says that Smith is 34 years old and the Chiefs had an opportunity to maybe get a franchise QB. A QB who they can groom for a couple year and take over for Smith so there is no lag. Sure it cost them picks. If Mahomes turns out to be that QB it's well worth the picks. That's the chance you have to take sometimes. Their in the same boat as the Cards. Just good enough not to get those top 5 or 7 picks so most if not all the good college QB are already taken.

    I think SK is hoping beyond hope that Gabbert is a bridge QB. Someone who can maybe give the Cards a couple good years so they have more time to find the right guy. He is only 27. If he were to turn into an above average QB the guy has at east 6 years of good play. That gives SK plenty of time to find his next QB. I also think SK knows Stanton isn't the answer, so he is looking for someone who can step in for Palmer. Gabbert fits that description a lot better than Stanton. SK doesn't think he can win with Stanton. Which I agree with.
    Agree. Gabbert is a young vet with plenty of BA attributes.

    The only puzzle is that Cards only signed him for vet minimum and 1 year. If he shows enough, Cards better tear up that 1 year deal and get him signed.

  5. #115
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    4,540

    Default

    Ew no. I'm good on Captain Conservative and I hope you guys aren't that desperate for a QB to be vouching for him either.
    Last edited by ~Main Event~; 05-24-2017 at 05:32 PM.

  6. #116
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Posts
    698

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Canyonram View Post
    So, when a QB that you personally like has a lousy W-L record, it is the fault of the team. When a QB that you personally don't care for has a lousy W-L record, it is the fault of the QB.

    Smith played under some of the worse conditions for a few years with SF and still left with a winning record. Palmer had a better team surrounding him in Cincy and left with a losing record. You can try and rewrite those facts any way you want and still be wrong.

    As to Palmer beating out Smith, take a look at the trade scenarios for both QBs.

    Palmer had little cred with the league after 'retiring' with millions of Cincy's money in his bank account. Palmer was held in such high regard by a QB hungry league that the Cards were able to trade for him at the cost of a swap of 2013 pick and a conditional 7th round pick---if Palmer was beaten out of the starting position by Stanton, he would have been FREE. Raiders went with Matt Flynn over Palmer. Guess his 35 TD-30 Int ratio was not good enough for the Raiders. Oakland dumped Palmer after only two years---In Oct.2011, the Bengals traded the "retired" Palmer to the Raiders for a first-round pick in 2012 and a second rounder in 2013 a significant amount of compensation for a quarterback who had no interest in playing for Cincy. Oakland walked away from Palmer even after the large draft investment. Palmer had put up some passing yards with Oakland, but as many fans can testify to, plenty of his passing yards came in 'garbage time' when the game was lost.

    http://www.nfl.com/videos/arizona-ca...zona-Cardinals

    I'll leave it to you to check out the trade cost to KC for Smith (PS It wasn't a FREEBIE).

    http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/9...as-city-chiefs

    KC is only doing their job in positioning themselves with a QBOTF. Smith is an aging vet (as is Palmer) and KC took the gamble that Mahomes would be their guy when Smith is at the end of the trail. If only the Cards had the same foresight.
    Why is KC a Super bowl contender with Alex Smith in his prime wasting draft picks? Isn't that your entire premise for why we should get him? How is it okay for them to trade away picks when Smith is 4 year younger than Palmer and they have a better team? By positioning themselves you mean moving up, giving away something this year that could help and next year that could help for a QBOTF that they don't need because they have Alex Smith. I respect that you want to have both sides of your argument.

    I never said I personally like Palmer. I think he is miles better than Smith. I recognize Palmer isn't perfect and is a far cry from the mobile QB coming out of College that put up astounding NFL numbers before he got hurt. Since the injury he has been mostly solid until he decided he could no longer work for the Bengals and forced his way out. The Raiders were as good or better with Palmer than they were with anyone else during a very long period of dysfunction. I believe Palmer has 1 of the 2 500 seasons the Raiders had in a 12 year period of dysfunction. Like has nothing to do with it. I hate Tom Brady, despised Dan Marino, I recognize Brady is in the argument for GOAT and Marino was an outright freak talent who was great.


    Smith is a veteran QB who is highly limited and he's been fortunate enough to have coaches who both know how to use him and surrounded him with great defense and running backs. Palmer was the key guy in getting a dysfunctional Bengals organization on the map. He has also been a central figure in the Cardinals resurgence. He has played well for us and he is asked to do a lot more than Smith. Smith has never passed for 4,000 yards, he routinely has TD numbers below 20. He is asked to throw short passes. He isn't asked to do what Palmer has been asked to do and I don't think he can. It's not personal, it's just how I see it. I suspect Gabbert may be able to do more for us than Smith can although Gabbert to date has done nothing.

  7. #117
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Posts
    1,337

    Default

    KC made the decision that Mahomes was worth the gamble and the draft picks. They have Smith under contract and will have opportunity to evaluate Mahomes and still have the protection of a vet QB in Smith.

    Cards chose not to make that gamble. I agree with that decision, especially with the QB options in this last draft. While Smith may not have the huge downfield arm, BA will suffer fewer ulcers over Mahomes playing playground street ball.

    When Palmer retires, Smith should be one of the QBs under consideration. He would bring a vet presence and understanding of pro-defenses. Cards would not have to devote several years on a college QB gamble while the rest of the roster ages and is not replaced by draft picks that were traded away.

    Cards can shift gears and go more to DJ and solidify the D. A proven 'game manager' will give us a better opportunity to win with our current roster than a QB undergoing on-the-job training.

  8. #118
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Posts
    254

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Canyonram View Post
    KC made the decision that Mahomes was worth the gamble and the draft picks. They have Smith under contract and will have opportunity to evaluate Mahomes and still have the protection of a vet QB in Smith.

    Cards chose not to make that gamble. I agree with that decision, especially with the QB options in this last draft. While Smith may not have the huge downfield arm, BA will suffer fewer ulcers over Mahomes playing playground street ball.

    When Palmer retires, Smith should be one of the QBs under consideration. He would bring a vet presence and understanding of pro-defenses. Cards would not have to devote several years on a college QB gamble while the rest of the roster ages and is not replaced by draft picks that were traded away.

    Cards can shift gears and go more to DJ and solidify the D. A proven 'game manager' will give us a better opportunity to win with our current roster than a QB undergoing on-the-job training.

    Stop.

  9. #119
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Posts
    1,337

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Birdgang95 View Post
    Stop.
    If you don't like my comments:

    (1) You STOP logging on to threads that I am interested in;

    (2) Put me on 'Ignore'

    (3) Come up with something to add to the forum besides one-syllable grunts.

  10. #120
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Posts
    1,337

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Biggs View Post
    Why is KC a Super bowl contender with Alex Smith in his prime wasting draft picks? Isn't that your entire premise for why we should get him? How is it okay for them to trade away picks when Smith is 4 year younger than Palmer and they have a better team? By positioning themselves you mean moving up, giving away something this year that could help and next year that could help for a QBOTF that they don't need because they have Alex Smith. I respect that you want to have both sides of your argument.

    I never said I personally like Palmer. I think he is miles better than Smith. I recognize Palmer isn't perfect and is a far cry from the mobile QB coming out of College that put up astounding NFL numbers before he got hurt. Since the injury he has been mostly solid until he decided he could no longer work for the Bengals and forced his way out. The Raiders were as good or better with Palmer than they were with anyone else during a very long period of dysfunction. I believe Palmer has 1 of the 2 500 seasons the Raiders had in a 12 year period of dysfunction. Like has nothing to do with it. I hate Tom Brady, despised Dan Marino, I recognize Brady is in the argument for GOAT and Marino was an outright freak talent who was great.


    Smith is a veteran QB who is highly limited and he's been fortunate enough to have coaches who both know how to use him and surrounded him with great defense and running backs. Palmer was the key guy in getting a dysfunctional Bengals organization on the map. He has also been a central figure in the Cardinals resurgence. He has played well for us and he is asked to do a lot more than Smith. Smith has never passed for 4,000 yards, he routinely has TD numbers below 20. He is asked to throw short passes. He isn't asked to do what Palmer has been asked to do and I don't think he can. It's not personal, it's just how I see it. I suspect Gabbert may be able to do more for us than Smith can although Gabbert to date has done nothing.
    At least cite the real stats. There's nothing 'astounding' about Palmer's numbers in the first two years he played before he was hurt on the first play in his first playoff game.

    In 2004, started 13 games and went 6-7 with 18 TD/18 Int. Played some of his best ball in 2005 with Cincy going 11-5 with 32 TD to 12 Int. He posted his career best comp% of 67.8. As to being 'mobile' he rushed 18 times for 47 yards in 2004 and 34 rushes for 41 yards in 2005. Not clear how these rushing numbers before he got hurt qualify as 'astounding.' His rushing stats have stayed pretty consistent with those first two years after the injury. For his career, Palmer is 287 rushes for 462 yds (by contrast, Smith is 469 for 2,078 yds).

    You "believe" wrong on Palmer's record with the Raiders. He did not put up a .500 season in the 1+ years he was their starter. He was 4-5 in 2011 and 4-11 in 2012 for an 8-16. He was so good for the Raiders that they literally gave him away to the Cards just to get him off their payroll.

    You 'suspect' that Gabbert can do more for the Cards than Smith while stating that "Gabbert to date has done nothing.' The 'I suspect' is a great method to evaluate talent.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •